National Assembly · Morning Sitting

Thereafter, the mediation committee will embark on an attempt to develop a version of the Bill for consideration by the Houses of Parliament in accordance with Article 113 of the Constitution. The House is accordingly guided. Thank you. Yes, Hon. Pukose.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. Article 149 of the Constitution provides that within 14 days after a vacancy in the Office of the Deputy President arises, the President shall nominate a person to fill the vacancy and the National Assembly shall vote on the nomination within 60 days after receiving it. Hon. Speaker, recently, while passing the Special Motion for Impeachment of the Deputy President, you g…

Order, Hon. Pukose. You are jumping the gun.

No! I am just seeking your guidance as to whether we need the same threshold in this case.

Okay. Go on.

Hon. Speaker, is the same voting threshold applicable in this case? I seek your guidance following your Communication from the Senate.

You are jumping the gun. We have a Communication from the Senate, which requires no comment.

Okay.

When I give the next message, you can seek that clarification.

Thank you. I am well guided.

[(Hon. Betty Maina spoke off the record)]

Hold your horses, Member for Murang’a County. Let us proceed to the next Order.

Hon. Speaker, if I do not have horses. What will I do?

[(Laughter)]

Hon. Betty, if you do not have horses, you hold your mule.

[(Laughter)]

Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker. I rise to respond to a request for statement that was raised yesterday by Hon. Chonga. There is enough evidence that the County Commissioner and the Deputy County Commissioner (DCC) are aware about what the Hon. Member raised about that family. Just because they do not have enough

resources, the man who had the resources had to throw them out of that land. So, it has been confirmed to that extent.

Is Hon. Ken Chonga in the House? That was his request for statement. Right?

Yes, Hon. Speaker. The task that you gave me yesterday was that the County Commissioner and the Deputy County Commissioner (DCC) should, this morning, sit and deliberate on the matter of removal of that family from their land. What they have also confirmed to me is that the matter is in court. Everybody was wondering how the family could be thrown out of their homestead. The Ministry, and specific…

Hon. Ken Chonga is not in the House. Therefore, we leave it that. Yes, Chairman.

Hon. Speaker, I know that my very able Vice-Chairman had presented a preliminary report on the matter, but I would like to update the House. The information could be available as early as this afternoon.

Will you deliver a statement in the afternoon?

Yes, Hon. Speaker.

Excellent! Member for Moyale, Hon. Jaldesa Guyo.

Hon. Speaker, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44 (2) (c) , I rise to request for a statement from the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs regarding re-opening of Hilo Gold Mine in Dabel, Moyale Constituency. In 2023, the residents of Moyale discovered traces of gold in the Hilo area of Dabel in Marsabit County. Following a prolonged drought b…

Hon. Speaker, it is against this background that I request for a statement from the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security on the

Order, Hon. Members. Clerks-at-the-Table, we will go back to Order No.3. Order, Members. Take your seats, Hon. Members who are on their feet.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44 (2) (c) , I rise to request for a statement from the Chairpersons of the Departmental Committees on Agriculture and Livestock, and on Regional Development, regarding the perpetual drought crisis and resultant loss of livelihoods in arid and semi-arid lands (ASALs) , especially in North Horr Constituency. The northern …

and victims of climate disasters from dependency on relief food to long-term and sustainable livelihoods and food security interventions. It is against this backdrop that I request for a statement from the Chairpersons of the Departmental Committees on Agriculture and Livestock, and on Regional Development, on

Thank you. That falls under which Committee? The Departmental Committee on Environment, Forestry and Mining?

The Departmental Committees on Agriculture and Livestock and on Regional Development.

Hon. Mutunga, are you here? Do you have any response or do you want to say something about it?

Hon. Deputy Speaker, we promise to bring a response in the next two weeks after the recess.

Thank you. Hon. Members, before we move to the next request for statement… Yes, I will come to the Questions. Before we continue with the responses to the requests for statements, I will give you an opportunity. We will go back to the Statements and so, you will have an opportunity to contribute, Hon. Pukose. Hon. Pukose, before we proceed with the statements, please allow me to re-order the Ord…

[(Hon. (Dr) Robert Pukose spoke off record)]

(National Assembly Bill number 53 of 2022) (Moved by Hon. Martin Owino on 16.10.2024-Afternoon Sitting)

Next Order.

Hon. Members, we will return to statements, and I think we have a statement. Yours was not the first one, Hon. Member. I have the list here. We are starting with the one for Hon. Bernard Kitur, Member of Parliament for Nandi Hills. I think it was supposed to be answered by the Administration and Internal Affairs Committee. Hon. Kitur.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 44 (2) (c) , I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs regarding the kidnapping and torture of Mr. Pasgalis Kosgei. Hon. Deputy Speaker, on 15th July 2024, Mr. Pasgalis Kosgei of ID No. 26289458, the Chairman of the Nandi Hills Boda Boda Association, was kidnapped in K…

demanding increased employment for locals and a reduction in the use of tea plucking machines. Before his abduction, Mr. Kosgei reported that he had received numerous calls regarding his whereabouts, including from a senior DCI officer, who was recently transferred from Nandi Hills. His kidnapping sparked significant outrage within the constituency and was reported at Nandi Hills Police Station un…

Chairperson of the Committee on Administration and National Affairs. Hon. Raso, you are speaking on behalf of the Chair. You may proceed.

I thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. This is fundamental. It is about human rights, the protection of lives, and the sanctity of life, which is enshrined in our constitution. But I think I will need two weeks after the recess to respond. Thank you.

I think it is one thing that I addressed with some of the committees. Even though we are going on recess, if you dispatch the letter now or during recess, then you can have a response by the time we come back from recess because the Executive is not on recess. I think you adjust it that way. Thank you. Next, we have a request for a statement from Hon. Christopher Aseka, Member for Khwisero.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44 (2) (c) , I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Administration and National Affairs regarding the scrapping of the application fees for the issuance of identity cards. Hon. Deputy Speaker, every Kenyan is entitled to the issuance of a national identification card upon maturity at…

timely access to opportunities requiring ID cards, but also the enjoyment of their inherent identity as citizens of Kenya. Hon. Deputy Speaker, it is against this background that I request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Administration and National Affairs on the

Thank you, Hon. Raso. Yes, proceed. Do you want to respond to him? It is in my timeline.

I think this is a hot issue in the country. Youngsters do not have anything. They live with their parents. They are told that to get an identification card, they must pay for it. I think it is something that we have not yet reached that stage, even as a country. Yes, in developed countries, youngsters start working as early as 15 years old and have some income. I think the Committee needs a seriou…

Hon. Raso, were the fees a gazetted regulation? How was it implemented?

Actually, Hon. Deputy Speaker, the fees were gazetted. It was a means of raising revenue for the State Department. However, there were no concerted discussions with the Committee of Parliament. Whereas it is out in the public domain, we need to review that position because it raises fundamental issues. The children of Members of Parliament can afford it, but what about the children of peasants who…

I assume it should have come to the Committee on Delegated Legislation. That is the point at which they could approve or nullify it. Liaise with that Committee.

The next request for a statement is by Hon. (Dr) Robert Pukose.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. This request for statement is from the Committee, and I am presenting it in my capacity as the Chairperson. Hon. Deputy Speaker, I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Education and Research regarding the Government financial assistance to students who are enrolled at the Kenya Medical Training College. Hon. Deputy …

It is against this background that I seek for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Education and Research on the following:

Thank you. Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Education and Research.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I want to commend Hon. (Dr) Pukose, the Chairperson, and the Members who have raised this particular issue. It is a very pertinent issue. As the rule requires, mid-level colleges and university students in the Republic should get loans and scholarships through the Higher Education Loans Board and the University Funding Board. I will fast-track this particular issue …

Thank you. Let us proceed with the next request for a statement by the Member for Tigania West, Hon. (Dr) John Mutunga.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Finance and National Planning regarding the utilisation of pension funds for nation-building.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, the Retirement Benefits Act of 1997 provides for, among other things, requirements for the effective management and investment of the pension funds in Kenya. The statute also establishes the Retirement Benefit Authority, which oversees the prudent management of pension schemes and ensures responsible investment of pension funds. The funds represent a significant pool of long-t…

The Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Finance and National Planning, Hon. Kuria.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I thank my colleague, the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Agriculture and Livestock, Hon. Mutunga, for requesting for that statement. I think the Committee will endeavour to go beyond the statement that has been sought. The pension savings, as a percentage of GDP in Kenya, is between 10 and 15 per cent. This is much lower than the global average of aro…

Thank you. The next request for a statement is by Hon. Paul Katana, Member for Kaloleni Constituency.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 4 (2) (c) , I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Tourism and Wildlife on elephant invasion in Kayafungo in Kaloleni. Kayafungo is a Sacred Giriama Shrine, that is set within a natural forest field with towering ancient trees. Unfortunately, the invasion of elephants has severely impacted the area, t…

creatures are an essential part of our national heritage, they have also become a major source of property damage and fear by the residents. Hon. Deputy Speaker, it is against this background that I seek for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Tourism and Wildlife. In the statement, the

Chairperson for the Departmental Committee on Tourism and Wildlife. Yes, Hon. Muge.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I am not the Chairperson or a member of the Departmental Committee. However, I want to add my voice to the said matter. I come from a county that has many animals, especially monkeys. This matter has to be accorded the attention it deserves. My county has a whole belt running through the valley of Aldai and Tinderet constituencies. Those people hardly harvest anything. Whatev…

Thank you. Is there a member of that Committee in the House? Hon. Waqo, we will task you to ensure it goes to the relevant Committee.

I will do so. Thank you.

Next, we have another request for a statement. Hon. Wanjiku Muhia, Member for Kipipiri Constituency.

We are ready to proceed, Hon. Temporary Chairman. Before the Chairman comes in, I will stand in for him.

Hon. Temporary Chairman, we looked at the amendment from the Senate on Clause 22 and after discussing and seeing the merits of the amendment from the Senate, we, as the Committee on Agriculture and Livestock, decided to approve the amendment from the Senate.

I would allow any intervention, if there is any. Yes, Hon. Milemba.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Chairman. Could the Chairman of that Committee explain the amendments for the sake of the public and this House. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Chairman. Hon. Justice Kemei (Sigowet/Soin, UDA) : Thank you, Hon. Temporary Chairman. The explanation is that in the Bill, we had used the terminology “conduct risk management”, appearing immediately after the words “the Comptroller …

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

[(Question, that the words to be left out be left out, put and agreed to)]

[(Question, that the words to be inserted in place thereof be inserted, put and agreed to)]

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

THAT, clause 25 of the Bill be amended in sub-clause (3) by inserting the following new sub-clause—

3A. On receipt of the report under subsection (3)(b), the governor shall submit the report to the respective county assembly. (Question of the amendment proposed) The Temporary Chairman (Hon. David Ochieng’): Hon. Oundo.

Again, as my colleague mwalimu raised issues, exactly what kind of report are we envisaging? What we have here and what the country has does not lead anywhere. What kind of report are we envisaging to be submitted to the county assembly? What is the county assembly expected to do with that report? That is considering, in many cases, the calibre of Members of County Assemblies (MCAs) in many county…

Yes,

As per the laws of the land, we would not expect a governor to submit any report, unless it is authorised by the respective county assembly. We are basically agreeing that it should go through the county assembly before it is passed.

Hon. Thuku.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Chair. I wish to support this amendment for the simple reason that members of the county assemblies are the representatives of the people. Indeed, any report that emanates from whatever quarter needs the approval and ratification of the county assemblies. We are talking of a very important Bill here. It is the Food and Feed Safety Control Coordination Bill. I come from a…

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

[(Question, that the words to be inserted be inserted, put and agreed to)(Senate amendment to Clause 25 agreed to)Senate amendment to the First Schedule]

I beg to move: THAT, the First Schedule be amended by inserting the following new items immediately after item no. 3– 3A. Each county government department dealing with matters relating to agriculture; 3B. Each county government department dealing with matters relating to health. We propose to reject this amendment because we will not be going down to various departments the moment we forward issu…

matters to county governments. The county governments will then deal as per the authorisation they have. (Question of the amendment proposed) The Temporary Chairman (Hon. David Ochieng’): Hon. Oundo.

I totally concur or agree with the Committee. At times, county governments overreach themselves. The small departments in counties, which are without value to the lives of the people should not be involved in very complicated matters like these ones. Once it has gotten to the county, the small departments have no budgets. They are only employment bureaus that have no technical ability to deal with…

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

I wanted to add my voice on the proposal before we approve it. We know agriculture is the backbone of our country. Formerly, before devolution, whoever was in the country would tell there were some serious activities to do with agriculture on the fields. Officers were being sent there, supporting farmers, and were having vehicles and motorbikes. Today, after devolution, county governments do not …

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

Thank you very much. I also support this amendment, but still give my voice on feeds. This is what we intend to do in empowering the relevant county government departments that are dealing with matters relating to agriculture. The issue of standards and certification is quite an important matter to this country today. The world is becoming a global village whereby we are now becoming borderless c…

[(Hon. Justice Kemei and Hon. Oscar Sudi stood along the gangways)]

The Temporary Chairman (Hon. David Ochieng’): Thank you. Hon. Kemei, take your seat. Hon. Oscar Sudi, can you take your seat? Hon. Members, I have to guide voting on this amendment. The Committee is proposing the rejection of the amendment and so, those who are supporting the Committee will vote Nay. Those who support the Senate amendment will vote Aye. I hope you are well guided. Yes, Hon. Mbai…

Maybe, the Member standing in for the Chairman could indicate the initial proposal of the Committee and the proposed amendment by the Senate. The Temporary Chairman : Hon. Mbai, that was long done. That is what we have just finished doing. The Chairman moved the amendment and explained the amendment. We proposed the question. It has been debated. Now we are voting. That is what has just happened…

[(Hon. David Ochieng’)]

[(Question, that the words to be inserted be inserted, put and negatived)]

[(Question proposed)]

[(Question put and agreed to)]

[(The House resumed)]

The Chairperson.

Hon. Speaker, I beg to report that the Committee of the whole House has considered Senate amendments to the Food and Feed Safety Control Coordination Bill, (National Assembly Bill No. 21 of 2023) , and approved the same with amendments.

Mover.

Dr. Mutunga.

Hon. Speaker, I beg to second.

[(Several Members walked into the Chamber)]

Hon. Members on their feet, take the nearest seat. Take your seats. Hon. Bashir and Hon. Rindikiri, take the nearest seat. Where is the nearest seat? Business Committee, authority was given for a Supplementary Order Paper, which the Clerk has prepared and the Speaker has approved for circulation. It is now available to you. Clerk, call out the next Order.

[(Question proposed)]

[(Question put and agreed to)(Senate amendments approved with further amendments)Hon. Members, as I indicated to you earlier, following the meeting of the House]

Hon. Joyce Kamene. Is she in the House? Hon. Kamene, you may start moving the Bill but, at some point, I will interrupt you to deal with the issue that we adjourned before you carry on.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I wish to move the Higher Education Loans Board (Amendment) Bill, (National Assembly Bill No. 58 of 2022) . Hon. Speaker, the principal object of this Bill is to amend the Higher Education Loans Board Act to address a specific challenge that is faced by some of the young students; that is, those who have not yet attained the age of 18 years and, as such, are ineligible t…

[(No. 3 of 1995)]

Hon. Joyce, for the record, you should have started by saying: "Hon. Speaker, I beg to move that the so-and-so Bill be now read a Second Time". After that, you can go on with the good things that you were saying.

Hon. Speaker, I wish to move this…

I beg to move...

Hon. Speaker, I beg to move that the Bill be read a Second Time.

Read the entire title of the Bill: "I beg to move

THAT, the Higher Education Loans Board (Amendment) Bill, (National Assembly Bill No.58 of 2022), be now read a Second Time".

THAT, the Higher Education Loans Board (Amendment) Bill, (National Assembly Bill No.58 of 2022) , be now read a Second Time. The principal object of this Bill is to amend the Higher Education Loans Board (HELB) Act No.3 of 1995 to address a specific challenge that is faced by our young students who have not yet attained the age of 18 years and, as such, are ineligible to apply for the HELB under …

Hon….?

[(Laughter)]

Hon. Oundo.

Order, Members! Hon. Oundo, hold your horses. Take your seat. Hon. Members, we will hold the Bill in Order No.11 that has been moved by the distinguished Member for Machakos County, Hon. Kamene. Hon. Oundo, you will second the Bill after we dispose of Order No.12 on the Supplementary Order Paper. We will proceed as follows: When Order No.12 on the Supplementary Order Paper is read, the Speaker wi…